$alpha + beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha + beta_{v})$? [on hold]












-1














On page 124 of Introduction to Set Theory, Jech claims that ordinal functions below are continuous in the second variable: If $gamma$ is a limit ordinal and $beta= sup_{v<gamma} beta_{v}$ then
$$alpha + beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha + beta_{v})$$
$$alpha . beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha . beta_{v})$$
$$alpha ^ beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha ^ {beta_{v}})$$
Then it is said that the results above are followed directly from the definitions!

Somebody has answered something over here which somehow asks the same question but the problem is question above which is directly taken from Jech book is stated in a slightly different way considering indexes and it has made some confusion for me since I am new to the topic. I would appreciate if you could clarify the exact arguments above.










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put on hold as off-topic by Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician 2 days ago


This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:


  • "This question is missing context or other details: Please provide additional context, which ideally explains why the question is relevant to you and our community. Some forms of context include: background and motivation, relevant definitions, source, possible strategies, your current progress, why the question is interesting or important, etc." – Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician

If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.









  • 2




    What definitions are you given for the ordinal arithmetic operations? It will make a big difference.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 2 at 23:32










  • I have already told you the reference book I cannot copy the whole book on SE just to make it clear for you!
    – FreeMind
    Jan 3 at 15:05






  • 1




    The whole book isn't necessary; only (a description of) the definitions in question will be needed. Without them, the only people who can help you are those who have access to the text and choose to avail themselves of it.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 3 at 18:10
















-1














On page 124 of Introduction to Set Theory, Jech claims that ordinal functions below are continuous in the second variable: If $gamma$ is a limit ordinal and $beta= sup_{v<gamma} beta_{v}$ then
$$alpha + beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha + beta_{v})$$
$$alpha . beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha . beta_{v})$$
$$alpha ^ beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha ^ {beta_{v}})$$
Then it is said that the results above are followed directly from the definitions!

Somebody has answered something over here which somehow asks the same question but the problem is question above which is directly taken from Jech book is stated in a slightly different way considering indexes and it has made some confusion for me since I am new to the topic. I would appreciate if you could clarify the exact arguments above.










share|cite|improve this question













put on hold as off-topic by Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician 2 days ago


This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:


  • "This question is missing context or other details: Please provide additional context, which ideally explains why the question is relevant to you and our community. Some forms of context include: background and motivation, relevant definitions, source, possible strategies, your current progress, why the question is interesting or important, etc." – Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician

If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.









  • 2




    What definitions are you given for the ordinal arithmetic operations? It will make a big difference.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 2 at 23:32










  • I have already told you the reference book I cannot copy the whole book on SE just to make it clear for you!
    – FreeMind
    Jan 3 at 15:05






  • 1




    The whole book isn't necessary; only (a description of) the definitions in question will be needed. Without them, the only people who can help you are those who have access to the text and choose to avail themselves of it.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 3 at 18:10














-1












-1








-1







On page 124 of Introduction to Set Theory, Jech claims that ordinal functions below are continuous in the second variable: If $gamma$ is a limit ordinal and $beta= sup_{v<gamma} beta_{v}$ then
$$alpha + beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha + beta_{v})$$
$$alpha . beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha . beta_{v})$$
$$alpha ^ beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha ^ {beta_{v}})$$
Then it is said that the results above are followed directly from the definitions!

Somebody has answered something over here which somehow asks the same question but the problem is question above which is directly taken from Jech book is stated in a slightly different way considering indexes and it has made some confusion for me since I am new to the topic. I would appreciate if you could clarify the exact arguments above.










share|cite|improve this question













On page 124 of Introduction to Set Theory, Jech claims that ordinal functions below are continuous in the second variable: If $gamma$ is a limit ordinal and $beta= sup_{v<gamma} beta_{v}$ then
$$alpha + beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha + beta_{v})$$
$$alpha . beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha . beta_{v})$$
$$alpha ^ beta = sup_{v<gamma} (alpha ^ {beta_{v}})$$
Then it is said that the results above are followed directly from the definitions!

Somebody has answered something over here which somehow asks the same question but the problem is question above which is directly taken from Jech book is stated in a slightly different way considering indexes and it has made some confusion for me since I am new to the topic. I would appreciate if you could clarify the exact arguments above.







logic set-theory proof-explanation ordinals






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asked Jan 2 at 23:25









FreeMindFreeMind

9101133




9101133




put on hold as off-topic by Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician 2 days ago


This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:


  • "This question is missing context or other details: Please provide additional context, which ideally explains why the question is relevant to you and our community. Some forms of context include: background and motivation, relevant definitions, source, possible strategies, your current progress, why the question is interesting or important, etc." – Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician

If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.




put on hold as off-topic by Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician 2 days ago


This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:


  • "This question is missing context or other details: Please provide additional context, which ideally explains why the question is relevant to you and our community. Some forms of context include: background and motivation, relevant definitions, source, possible strategies, your current progress, why the question is interesting or important, etc." – Cameron Buie, Lord Shark the Unknown, user91500, Lord_Farin, ancientmathematician

If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.








  • 2




    What definitions are you given for the ordinal arithmetic operations? It will make a big difference.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 2 at 23:32










  • I have already told you the reference book I cannot copy the whole book on SE just to make it clear for you!
    – FreeMind
    Jan 3 at 15:05






  • 1




    The whole book isn't necessary; only (a description of) the definitions in question will be needed. Without them, the only people who can help you are those who have access to the text and choose to avail themselves of it.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 3 at 18:10














  • 2




    What definitions are you given for the ordinal arithmetic operations? It will make a big difference.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 2 at 23:32










  • I have already told you the reference book I cannot copy the whole book on SE just to make it clear for you!
    – FreeMind
    Jan 3 at 15:05






  • 1




    The whole book isn't necessary; only (a description of) the definitions in question will be needed. Without them, the only people who can help you are those who have access to the text and choose to avail themselves of it.
    – Cameron Buie
    Jan 3 at 18:10








2




2




What definitions are you given for the ordinal arithmetic operations? It will make a big difference.
– Cameron Buie
Jan 2 at 23:32




What definitions are you given for the ordinal arithmetic operations? It will make a big difference.
– Cameron Buie
Jan 2 at 23:32












I have already told you the reference book I cannot copy the whole book on SE just to make it clear for you!
– FreeMind
Jan 3 at 15:05




I have already told you the reference book I cannot copy the whole book on SE just to make it clear for you!
– FreeMind
Jan 3 at 15:05




1




1




The whole book isn't necessary; only (a description of) the definitions in question will be needed. Without them, the only people who can help you are those who have access to the text and choose to avail themselves of it.
– Cameron Buie
Jan 3 at 18:10




The whole book isn't necessary; only (a description of) the definitions in question will be needed. Without them, the only people who can help you are those who have access to the text and choose to avail themselves of it.
– Cameron Buie
Jan 3 at 18:10










1 Answer
1






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oldest

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1














I am going to explain how to prove the continuity of addition, the rest facts can be proved in similar fashion. First of all, we should keep in mind the monotonicity of addition in the second variable. We now that $$alpha + beta = sup{alpha + rhocolon rho<beta}.$$
WLOG we can consider $beta$ to be a limit ordinal. Hence for every $nu<gamma$ we have $beta_nu < beta$, hence $alpha + beta_nu < alpha + beta$, hence by the definition of supremum $$sup{alpha + beta_nucolon nu<gamma} leq alpha + beta.$$
It remains to prove the converse inequality. Let $rho<beta$. There exists $nu_0<gamma$ such that $rho<beta_{nu_0}$ (otherwise all $beta_nu$ would be less or equal than $rho<beta$). By monotonicity $alpha + rho < alpha + beta_{nu_0}$, so $alpha+rho<sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}$, again by the definition of supremum we get
$$
alpha+beta leq sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}.
$$

These two inequalities give us the desired equality.






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New contributor




Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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    1 Answer
    1






    active

    oldest

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    1 Answer
    1






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

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    active

    oldest

    votes









    1














    I am going to explain how to prove the continuity of addition, the rest facts can be proved in similar fashion. First of all, we should keep in mind the monotonicity of addition in the second variable. We now that $$alpha + beta = sup{alpha + rhocolon rho<beta}.$$
    WLOG we can consider $beta$ to be a limit ordinal. Hence for every $nu<gamma$ we have $beta_nu < beta$, hence $alpha + beta_nu < alpha + beta$, hence by the definition of supremum $$sup{alpha + beta_nucolon nu<gamma} leq alpha + beta.$$
    It remains to prove the converse inequality. Let $rho<beta$. There exists $nu_0<gamma$ such that $rho<beta_{nu_0}$ (otherwise all $beta_nu$ would be less or equal than $rho<beta$). By monotonicity $alpha + rho < alpha + beta_{nu_0}$, so $alpha+rho<sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}$, again by the definition of supremum we get
    $$
    alpha+beta leq sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}.
    $$

    These two inequalities give us the desired equality.






    share|cite|improve this answer








    New contributor




    Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.























      1














      I am going to explain how to prove the continuity of addition, the rest facts can be proved in similar fashion. First of all, we should keep in mind the monotonicity of addition in the second variable. We now that $$alpha + beta = sup{alpha + rhocolon rho<beta}.$$
      WLOG we can consider $beta$ to be a limit ordinal. Hence for every $nu<gamma$ we have $beta_nu < beta$, hence $alpha + beta_nu < alpha + beta$, hence by the definition of supremum $$sup{alpha + beta_nucolon nu<gamma} leq alpha + beta.$$
      It remains to prove the converse inequality. Let $rho<beta$. There exists $nu_0<gamma$ such that $rho<beta_{nu_0}$ (otherwise all $beta_nu$ would be less or equal than $rho<beta$). By monotonicity $alpha + rho < alpha + beta_{nu_0}$, so $alpha+rho<sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}$, again by the definition of supremum we get
      $$
      alpha+beta leq sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}.
      $$

      These two inequalities give us the desired equality.






      share|cite|improve this answer








      New contributor




      Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.





















        1












        1








        1






        I am going to explain how to prove the continuity of addition, the rest facts can be proved in similar fashion. First of all, we should keep in mind the monotonicity of addition in the second variable. We now that $$alpha + beta = sup{alpha + rhocolon rho<beta}.$$
        WLOG we can consider $beta$ to be a limit ordinal. Hence for every $nu<gamma$ we have $beta_nu < beta$, hence $alpha + beta_nu < alpha + beta$, hence by the definition of supremum $$sup{alpha + beta_nucolon nu<gamma} leq alpha + beta.$$
        It remains to prove the converse inequality. Let $rho<beta$. There exists $nu_0<gamma$ such that $rho<beta_{nu_0}$ (otherwise all $beta_nu$ would be less or equal than $rho<beta$). By monotonicity $alpha + rho < alpha + beta_{nu_0}$, so $alpha+rho<sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}$, again by the definition of supremum we get
        $$
        alpha+beta leq sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}.
        $$

        These two inequalities give us the desired equality.






        share|cite|improve this answer








        New contributor




        Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.









        I am going to explain how to prove the continuity of addition, the rest facts can be proved in similar fashion. First of all, we should keep in mind the monotonicity of addition in the second variable. We now that $$alpha + beta = sup{alpha + rhocolon rho<beta}.$$
        WLOG we can consider $beta$ to be a limit ordinal. Hence for every $nu<gamma$ we have $beta_nu < beta$, hence $alpha + beta_nu < alpha + beta$, hence by the definition of supremum $$sup{alpha + beta_nucolon nu<gamma} leq alpha + beta.$$
        It remains to prove the converse inequality. Let $rho<beta$. There exists $nu_0<gamma$ such that $rho<beta_{nu_0}$ (otherwise all $beta_nu$ would be less or equal than $rho<beta$). By monotonicity $alpha + rho < alpha + beta_{nu_0}$, so $alpha+rho<sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}$, again by the definition of supremum we get
        $$
        alpha+beta leq sup{alpha+beta_nucolon nu<gamma}.
        $$

        These two inequalities give us the desired equality.







        share|cite|improve this answer








        New contributor




        Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.









        share|cite|improve this answer



        share|cite|improve this answer






        New contributor




        Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.









        answered Jan 4 at 7:29









        Ilya VlasovIlya Vlasov

        10311




        10311




        New contributor




        Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.





        New contributor





        Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.






        Ilya Vlasov is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.















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