Is this “Superior Darkvision” spell balanced?












2














The spell would read as follows:




Superior Darkvision



2nd-level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S
Duration: 1 hour

You touch a willing creature to grant it the ability to see in the dark. For the duration, that creature can see as if the area was brightly lit out to a range of 30 feet, treating areas beyond that as usual




The reason I want this spell is that, as discussed in the link below, most base races have darkvision, which makes the typical darkvision spell not as useful. The idea with this spell is that it would replace the normal darkvision spell.



What can or should be changed to make this a balanced spell? (Changing spell level, changing duration, adding concentration, etc.)



Ideally I'd want to keep the spell level as is.



See also: This answer to "What would happen if I removed darkvision?"










share|improve this question





























    2














    The spell would read as follows:




    Superior Darkvision



    2nd-level transmutation
    Casting Time: 1 action
    Range: Touch
    Components: V, S
    Duration: 1 hour

    You touch a willing creature to grant it the ability to see in the dark. For the duration, that creature can see as if the area was brightly lit out to a range of 30 feet, treating areas beyond that as usual




    The reason I want this spell is that, as discussed in the link below, most base races have darkvision, which makes the typical darkvision spell not as useful. The idea with this spell is that it would replace the normal darkvision spell.



    What can or should be changed to make this a balanced spell? (Changing spell level, changing duration, adding concentration, etc.)



    Ideally I'd want to keep the spell level as is.



    See also: This answer to "What would happen if I removed darkvision?"










    share|improve this question



























      2












      2








      2







      The spell would read as follows:




      Superior Darkvision



      2nd-level transmutation
      Casting Time: 1 action
      Range: Touch
      Components: V, S
      Duration: 1 hour

      You touch a willing creature to grant it the ability to see in the dark. For the duration, that creature can see as if the area was brightly lit out to a range of 30 feet, treating areas beyond that as usual




      The reason I want this spell is that, as discussed in the link below, most base races have darkvision, which makes the typical darkvision spell not as useful. The idea with this spell is that it would replace the normal darkvision spell.



      What can or should be changed to make this a balanced spell? (Changing spell level, changing duration, adding concentration, etc.)



      Ideally I'd want to keep the spell level as is.



      See also: This answer to "What would happen if I removed darkvision?"










      share|improve this question















      The spell would read as follows:




      Superior Darkvision



      2nd-level transmutation
      Casting Time: 1 action
      Range: Touch
      Components: V, S
      Duration: 1 hour

      You touch a willing creature to grant it the ability to see in the dark. For the duration, that creature can see as if the area was brightly lit out to a range of 30 feet, treating areas beyond that as usual




      The reason I want this spell is that, as discussed in the link below, most base races have darkvision, which makes the typical darkvision spell not as useful. The idea with this spell is that it would replace the normal darkvision spell.



      What can or should be changed to make this a balanced spell? (Changing spell level, changing duration, adding concentration, etc.)



      Ideally I'd want to keep the spell level as is.



      See also: This answer to "What would happen if I removed darkvision?"







      dnd-5e spells homebrew balance vision-and-light






      share|improve this question















      share|improve this question













      share|improve this question




      share|improve this question








      edited yesterday









      V2Blast

      19.7k356121




      19.7k356121










      asked yesterday









      L0neGamer

      1,244317




      1,244317






















          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

          votes


















          12














          This spell should probably be 3rd level, not 2nd level



          The issue right now is that as-written, this spell is strictly better than the Darkvision spell in every respect except for its range and duration, which is not consequential enough to keep the spell as a 2nd level spell.



          It's not quite as powerful as a 6th level spell, though, like Truesight, which has a longer range and detects lots of other things than just allowing vision in darkness. So that puts a firm upper bound on the power level this spell should target.



          Pros:




          • Allows normal Perception checks in pure Darkness

          • Has no Material Component (can be cast without a focus)


          Cons:




          • Lower Range (normal Darkvision has a range of 60', this has 30')

          • Shorter Duration (normal Darkvision has a duration of 8 hours, this lasts 1 hour)


          The heightened perception check range is very significant though. Normally, when detecting a hidden creature or object, having disadvantage on Perception would confer a flat -5 penalty to their passive checks, meaning a whole lot of hidden creatures, traps, etc. would be suddenly easy to spot with this spell. Normally, to gain that kind of perception, you'd need to use the regular Darkvision spell and use a torch or some other kind of light effect to at least bring the light level up to Dim. This spell negates the need for any secondary light source, which makes it superior.






          share|improve this answer





















          • how exactly normal darkvision doesn't allow for perception check ?
            – Franck
            yesterday






          • 1




            @Franck It doesn't disallow normal perception checks, but even with Darkvision, pure darkness is still treated as Dim light, i.e. Disadvantage on Perception checks. The spell the OP is proposing doesn't have that issue.
            – Xirema
            yesterday










          • I completely overlooked that detail in the original spell. I always assumed it was only for 60' and up that the disadvantage applied to.
            – Franck
            yesterday












          • I think this answer can be improved by discussing interactions with cheap light sources (such as a cantrip effectively giving a similar vision radius), but is otherwise a good answer.
            – L0neGamer
            15 hours ago



















          4














          I suggest that you ask yourself: Would I ever voluntarily take this as a second-level spell? If the answer is "no" or "probably not", then your spell is set at or above the correct spell level.



          Comparing this to the existing Darkvision spell is probably not the best gauge, as it assumes that Darkvision is balanced at L2. Darkvision is probably one of the most situational spells at L2. Few players seem to take Darkvision as-is, at least until higher levels, when the cost of the slot and the spell known is negligible. If you're playing a human or halfling caster, you've probably got a cheaper way of dealing with your lack of innate darkvision than a spell known and a second-level slot. Even then, the spell's use is limited to Humans and Halflings.



          At level 3, you can take this or something like Hypnotic Pattern, Plant Growth, Haste or Fireball. Your players have better things to do with their L3 spell slots than fixing their lack of innate darkvision.



          It is unclear how this spell interacts with magical darkness, such as in the Darkness spell. This would be a major factor regarding whether this spell is worth taking because you can effectively give yourself full cover while maintaining vision, which is definitely worth a L2 slot. Some food for thought.






          share|improve this answer























            Your Answer





            StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
            return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
            StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
            StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["\$", "\$"]]);
            });
            });
            }, "mathjax-editing");

            StackExchange.ready(function() {
            var channelOptions = {
            tags: "".split(" "),
            id: "122"
            };
            initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

            StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
            // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
            if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
            StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
            createEditor();
            });
            }
            else {
            createEditor();
            }
            });

            function createEditor() {
            StackExchange.prepareEditor({
            heartbeatType: 'answer',
            autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
            convertImagesToLinks: false,
            noModals: true,
            showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
            reputationToPostImages: null,
            bindNavPrevention: true,
            postfix: "",
            imageUploader: {
            brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
            contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
            allowUrls: true
            },
            noCode: true, onDemand: true,
            discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
            ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
            });


            }
            });














            draft saved

            draft discarded


















            StackExchange.ready(
            function () {
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2frpg.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f138395%2fis-this-superior-darkvision-spell-balanced%23new-answer', 'question_page');
            }
            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown

























            2 Answers
            2






            active

            oldest

            votes








            2 Answers
            2






            active

            oldest

            votes









            active

            oldest

            votes






            active

            oldest

            votes









            12














            This spell should probably be 3rd level, not 2nd level



            The issue right now is that as-written, this spell is strictly better than the Darkvision spell in every respect except for its range and duration, which is not consequential enough to keep the spell as a 2nd level spell.



            It's not quite as powerful as a 6th level spell, though, like Truesight, which has a longer range and detects lots of other things than just allowing vision in darkness. So that puts a firm upper bound on the power level this spell should target.



            Pros:




            • Allows normal Perception checks in pure Darkness

            • Has no Material Component (can be cast without a focus)


            Cons:




            • Lower Range (normal Darkvision has a range of 60', this has 30')

            • Shorter Duration (normal Darkvision has a duration of 8 hours, this lasts 1 hour)


            The heightened perception check range is very significant though. Normally, when detecting a hidden creature or object, having disadvantage on Perception would confer a flat -5 penalty to their passive checks, meaning a whole lot of hidden creatures, traps, etc. would be suddenly easy to spot with this spell. Normally, to gain that kind of perception, you'd need to use the regular Darkvision spell and use a torch or some other kind of light effect to at least bring the light level up to Dim. This spell negates the need for any secondary light source, which makes it superior.






            share|improve this answer





















            • how exactly normal darkvision doesn't allow for perception check ?
              – Franck
              yesterday






            • 1




              @Franck It doesn't disallow normal perception checks, but even with Darkvision, pure darkness is still treated as Dim light, i.e. Disadvantage on Perception checks. The spell the OP is proposing doesn't have that issue.
              – Xirema
              yesterday










            • I completely overlooked that detail in the original spell. I always assumed it was only for 60' and up that the disadvantage applied to.
              – Franck
              yesterday












            • I think this answer can be improved by discussing interactions with cheap light sources (such as a cantrip effectively giving a similar vision radius), but is otherwise a good answer.
              – L0neGamer
              15 hours ago
















            12














            This spell should probably be 3rd level, not 2nd level



            The issue right now is that as-written, this spell is strictly better than the Darkvision spell in every respect except for its range and duration, which is not consequential enough to keep the spell as a 2nd level spell.



            It's not quite as powerful as a 6th level spell, though, like Truesight, which has a longer range and detects lots of other things than just allowing vision in darkness. So that puts a firm upper bound on the power level this spell should target.



            Pros:




            • Allows normal Perception checks in pure Darkness

            • Has no Material Component (can be cast without a focus)


            Cons:




            • Lower Range (normal Darkvision has a range of 60', this has 30')

            • Shorter Duration (normal Darkvision has a duration of 8 hours, this lasts 1 hour)


            The heightened perception check range is very significant though. Normally, when detecting a hidden creature or object, having disadvantage on Perception would confer a flat -5 penalty to their passive checks, meaning a whole lot of hidden creatures, traps, etc. would be suddenly easy to spot with this spell. Normally, to gain that kind of perception, you'd need to use the regular Darkvision spell and use a torch or some other kind of light effect to at least bring the light level up to Dim. This spell negates the need for any secondary light source, which makes it superior.






            share|improve this answer





















            • how exactly normal darkvision doesn't allow for perception check ?
              – Franck
              yesterday






            • 1




              @Franck It doesn't disallow normal perception checks, but even with Darkvision, pure darkness is still treated as Dim light, i.e. Disadvantage on Perception checks. The spell the OP is proposing doesn't have that issue.
              – Xirema
              yesterday










            • I completely overlooked that detail in the original spell. I always assumed it was only for 60' and up that the disadvantage applied to.
              – Franck
              yesterday












            • I think this answer can be improved by discussing interactions with cheap light sources (such as a cantrip effectively giving a similar vision radius), but is otherwise a good answer.
              – L0neGamer
              15 hours ago














            12












            12








            12






            This spell should probably be 3rd level, not 2nd level



            The issue right now is that as-written, this spell is strictly better than the Darkvision spell in every respect except for its range and duration, which is not consequential enough to keep the spell as a 2nd level spell.



            It's not quite as powerful as a 6th level spell, though, like Truesight, which has a longer range and detects lots of other things than just allowing vision in darkness. So that puts a firm upper bound on the power level this spell should target.



            Pros:




            • Allows normal Perception checks in pure Darkness

            • Has no Material Component (can be cast without a focus)


            Cons:




            • Lower Range (normal Darkvision has a range of 60', this has 30')

            • Shorter Duration (normal Darkvision has a duration of 8 hours, this lasts 1 hour)


            The heightened perception check range is very significant though. Normally, when detecting a hidden creature or object, having disadvantage on Perception would confer a flat -5 penalty to their passive checks, meaning a whole lot of hidden creatures, traps, etc. would be suddenly easy to spot with this spell. Normally, to gain that kind of perception, you'd need to use the regular Darkvision spell and use a torch or some other kind of light effect to at least bring the light level up to Dim. This spell negates the need for any secondary light source, which makes it superior.






            share|improve this answer












            This spell should probably be 3rd level, not 2nd level



            The issue right now is that as-written, this spell is strictly better than the Darkvision spell in every respect except for its range and duration, which is not consequential enough to keep the spell as a 2nd level spell.



            It's not quite as powerful as a 6th level spell, though, like Truesight, which has a longer range and detects lots of other things than just allowing vision in darkness. So that puts a firm upper bound on the power level this spell should target.



            Pros:




            • Allows normal Perception checks in pure Darkness

            • Has no Material Component (can be cast without a focus)


            Cons:




            • Lower Range (normal Darkvision has a range of 60', this has 30')

            • Shorter Duration (normal Darkvision has a duration of 8 hours, this lasts 1 hour)


            The heightened perception check range is very significant though. Normally, when detecting a hidden creature or object, having disadvantage on Perception would confer a flat -5 penalty to their passive checks, meaning a whole lot of hidden creatures, traps, etc. would be suddenly easy to spot with this spell. Normally, to gain that kind of perception, you'd need to use the regular Darkvision spell and use a torch or some other kind of light effect to at least bring the light level up to Dim. This spell negates the need for any secondary light source, which makes it superior.







            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered yesterday









            Xirema

            16.2k246100




            16.2k246100












            • how exactly normal darkvision doesn't allow for perception check ?
              – Franck
              yesterday






            • 1




              @Franck It doesn't disallow normal perception checks, but even with Darkvision, pure darkness is still treated as Dim light, i.e. Disadvantage on Perception checks. The spell the OP is proposing doesn't have that issue.
              – Xirema
              yesterday










            • I completely overlooked that detail in the original spell. I always assumed it was only for 60' and up that the disadvantage applied to.
              – Franck
              yesterday












            • I think this answer can be improved by discussing interactions with cheap light sources (such as a cantrip effectively giving a similar vision radius), but is otherwise a good answer.
              – L0neGamer
              15 hours ago


















            • how exactly normal darkvision doesn't allow for perception check ?
              – Franck
              yesterday






            • 1




              @Franck It doesn't disallow normal perception checks, but even with Darkvision, pure darkness is still treated as Dim light, i.e. Disadvantage on Perception checks. The spell the OP is proposing doesn't have that issue.
              – Xirema
              yesterday










            • I completely overlooked that detail in the original spell. I always assumed it was only for 60' and up that the disadvantage applied to.
              – Franck
              yesterday












            • I think this answer can be improved by discussing interactions with cheap light sources (such as a cantrip effectively giving a similar vision radius), but is otherwise a good answer.
              – L0neGamer
              15 hours ago
















            how exactly normal darkvision doesn't allow for perception check ?
            – Franck
            yesterday




            how exactly normal darkvision doesn't allow for perception check ?
            – Franck
            yesterday




            1




            1




            @Franck It doesn't disallow normal perception checks, but even with Darkvision, pure darkness is still treated as Dim light, i.e. Disadvantage on Perception checks. The spell the OP is proposing doesn't have that issue.
            – Xirema
            yesterday




            @Franck It doesn't disallow normal perception checks, but even with Darkvision, pure darkness is still treated as Dim light, i.e. Disadvantage on Perception checks. The spell the OP is proposing doesn't have that issue.
            – Xirema
            yesterday












            I completely overlooked that detail in the original spell. I always assumed it was only for 60' and up that the disadvantage applied to.
            – Franck
            yesterday






            I completely overlooked that detail in the original spell. I always assumed it was only for 60' and up that the disadvantage applied to.
            – Franck
            yesterday














            I think this answer can be improved by discussing interactions with cheap light sources (such as a cantrip effectively giving a similar vision radius), but is otherwise a good answer.
            – L0neGamer
            15 hours ago




            I think this answer can be improved by discussing interactions with cheap light sources (such as a cantrip effectively giving a similar vision radius), but is otherwise a good answer.
            – L0neGamer
            15 hours ago













            4














            I suggest that you ask yourself: Would I ever voluntarily take this as a second-level spell? If the answer is "no" or "probably not", then your spell is set at or above the correct spell level.



            Comparing this to the existing Darkvision spell is probably not the best gauge, as it assumes that Darkvision is balanced at L2. Darkvision is probably one of the most situational spells at L2. Few players seem to take Darkvision as-is, at least until higher levels, when the cost of the slot and the spell known is negligible. If you're playing a human or halfling caster, you've probably got a cheaper way of dealing with your lack of innate darkvision than a spell known and a second-level slot. Even then, the spell's use is limited to Humans and Halflings.



            At level 3, you can take this or something like Hypnotic Pattern, Plant Growth, Haste or Fireball. Your players have better things to do with their L3 spell slots than fixing their lack of innate darkvision.



            It is unclear how this spell interacts with magical darkness, such as in the Darkness spell. This would be a major factor regarding whether this spell is worth taking because you can effectively give yourself full cover while maintaining vision, which is definitely worth a L2 slot. Some food for thought.






            share|improve this answer




























              4














              I suggest that you ask yourself: Would I ever voluntarily take this as a second-level spell? If the answer is "no" or "probably not", then your spell is set at or above the correct spell level.



              Comparing this to the existing Darkvision spell is probably not the best gauge, as it assumes that Darkvision is balanced at L2. Darkvision is probably one of the most situational spells at L2. Few players seem to take Darkvision as-is, at least until higher levels, when the cost of the slot and the spell known is negligible. If you're playing a human or halfling caster, you've probably got a cheaper way of dealing with your lack of innate darkvision than a spell known and a second-level slot. Even then, the spell's use is limited to Humans and Halflings.



              At level 3, you can take this or something like Hypnotic Pattern, Plant Growth, Haste or Fireball. Your players have better things to do with their L3 spell slots than fixing their lack of innate darkvision.



              It is unclear how this spell interacts with magical darkness, such as in the Darkness spell. This would be a major factor regarding whether this spell is worth taking because you can effectively give yourself full cover while maintaining vision, which is definitely worth a L2 slot. Some food for thought.






              share|improve this answer


























                4












                4








                4






                I suggest that you ask yourself: Would I ever voluntarily take this as a second-level spell? If the answer is "no" or "probably not", then your spell is set at or above the correct spell level.



                Comparing this to the existing Darkvision spell is probably not the best gauge, as it assumes that Darkvision is balanced at L2. Darkvision is probably one of the most situational spells at L2. Few players seem to take Darkvision as-is, at least until higher levels, when the cost of the slot and the spell known is negligible. If you're playing a human or halfling caster, you've probably got a cheaper way of dealing with your lack of innate darkvision than a spell known and a second-level slot. Even then, the spell's use is limited to Humans and Halflings.



                At level 3, you can take this or something like Hypnotic Pattern, Plant Growth, Haste or Fireball. Your players have better things to do with their L3 spell slots than fixing their lack of innate darkvision.



                It is unclear how this spell interacts with magical darkness, such as in the Darkness spell. This would be a major factor regarding whether this spell is worth taking because you can effectively give yourself full cover while maintaining vision, which is definitely worth a L2 slot. Some food for thought.






                share|improve this answer














                I suggest that you ask yourself: Would I ever voluntarily take this as a second-level spell? If the answer is "no" or "probably not", then your spell is set at or above the correct spell level.



                Comparing this to the existing Darkvision spell is probably not the best gauge, as it assumes that Darkvision is balanced at L2. Darkvision is probably one of the most situational spells at L2. Few players seem to take Darkvision as-is, at least until higher levels, when the cost of the slot and the spell known is negligible. If you're playing a human or halfling caster, you've probably got a cheaper way of dealing with your lack of innate darkvision than a spell known and a second-level slot. Even then, the spell's use is limited to Humans and Halflings.



                At level 3, you can take this or something like Hypnotic Pattern, Plant Growth, Haste or Fireball. Your players have better things to do with their L3 spell slots than fixing their lack of innate darkvision.



                It is unclear how this spell interacts with magical darkness, such as in the Darkness spell. This would be a major factor regarding whether this spell is worth taking because you can effectively give yourself full cover while maintaining vision, which is definitely worth a L2 slot. Some food for thought.







                share|improve this answer














                share|improve this answer



                share|improve this answer








                edited 12 hours ago

























                answered yesterday









                James

                1295




                1295






























                    draft saved

                    draft discarded




















































                    Thanks for contributing an answer to Role-playing Games Stack Exchange!


                    • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

                    But avoid



                    • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

                    • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


                    Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


                    To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.





                    Some of your past answers have not been well-received, and you're in danger of being blocked from answering.


                    Please pay close attention to the following guidance:


                    • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

                    But avoid



                    • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

                    • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.


                    To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




                    draft saved


                    draft discarded














                    StackExchange.ready(
                    function () {
                    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2frpg.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f138395%2fis-this-superior-darkvision-spell-balanced%23new-answer', 'question_page');
                    }
                    );

                    Post as a guest















                    Required, but never shown





















































                    Required, but never shown














                    Required, but never shown












                    Required, but never shown







                    Required, but never shown

































                    Required, but never shown














                    Required, but never shown












                    Required, but never shown







                    Required, but never shown







                    Popular posts from this blog

                    1300-talet

                    1300-talet

                    Display a custom attribute below product name in the front-end Magento 1.9.3.8