Make a short exact sequence of abstract groups into a short exact sequence of topological groups (motivated...
$begingroup$
Let $1 to H_1 to G to H_2 to 1$ be a short exact sequence of abstract groups.
Question: If $H_1$, $H_2$ have fixed topologies, can we endow $G$ with a topology such that the sequence above becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups? If yes, is this topology then uniquely determined?
Motivation: I want to understand the topology of the Weil group $W_K$ which is a dense subgroup of the absolute Galois group $G_K$ (which has this weird profinite topology I find hard to get). However, we have a short exact sequence of abstract groups
$$1 to I_K to W_K to langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle to 1$$
where $I_K$ denotes the inertia subgroup of $G_K$ and $operatorname{Frob}_k : x mapsto x^{|k|}$ is the Frobenius element of the absolute Galois group $G_k$ of the residue field $k$ of $K$.
If I understand it correctly, this sequence is not a short exact sequence of topological groups if we give $W_K$ the subspace topology of $G_K$. However, if we give $I_K$ and $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ the subspace topologies of $G_K$ and $G_k$ respectively, we can give $W_K$ a unique topology such that this sequence becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups.
I heard that this causes $W_K$ to have a finer topology than the usual subspace topology, $I_K$ to be open and the maximal compact subgroup of $W_K$ etc. but I do not really understand that.
Could you please explain this to me? Thank you!
abstract-algebra general-topology group-theory algebraic-number-theory topological-groups
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $1 to H_1 to G to H_2 to 1$ be a short exact sequence of abstract groups.
Question: If $H_1$, $H_2$ have fixed topologies, can we endow $G$ with a topology such that the sequence above becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups? If yes, is this topology then uniquely determined?
Motivation: I want to understand the topology of the Weil group $W_K$ which is a dense subgroup of the absolute Galois group $G_K$ (which has this weird profinite topology I find hard to get). However, we have a short exact sequence of abstract groups
$$1 to I_K to W_K to langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle to 1$$
where $I_K$ denotes the inertia subgroup of $G_K$ and $operatorname{Frob}_k : x mapsto x^{|k|}$ is the Frobenius element of the absolute Galois group $G_k$ of the residue field $k$ of $K$.
If I understand it correctly, this sequence is not a short exact sequence of topological groups if we give $W_K$ the subspace topology of $G_K$. However, if we give $I_K$ and $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ the subspace topologies of $G_K$ and $G_k$ respectively, we can give $W_K$ a unique topology such that this sequence becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups.
I heard that this causes $W_K$ to have a finer topology than the usual subspace topology, $I_K$ to be open and the maximal compact subgroup of $W_K$ etc. but I do not really understand that.
Could you please explain this to me? Thank you!
abstract-algebra general-topology group-theory algebraic-number-theory topological-groups
$endgroup$
3
$begingroup$
You don't want $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ to have the suspace topology from $G_k$, but instead the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– MatheinBoulomenos
Jan 6 at 21:32
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $1 to H_1 to G to H_2 to 1$ be a short exact sequence of abstract groups.
Question: If $H_1$, $H_2$ have fixed topologies, can we endow $G$ with a topology such that the sequence above becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups? If yes, is this topology then uniquely determined?
Motivation: I want to understand the topology of the Weil group $W_K$ which is a dense subgroup of the absolute Galois group $G_K$ (which has this weird profinite topology I find hard to get). However, we have a short exact sequence of abstract groups
$$1 to I_K to W_K to langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle to 1$$
where $I_K$ denotes the inertia subgroup of $G_K$ and $operatorname{Frob}_k : x mapsto x^{|k|}$ is the Frobenius element of the absolute Galois group $G_k$ of the residue field $k$ of $K$.
If I understand it correctly, this sequence is not a short exact sequence of topological groups if we give $W_K$ the subspace topology of $G_K$. However, if we give $I_K$ and $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ the subspace topologies of $G_K$ and $G_k$ respectively, we can give $W_K$ a unique topology such that this sequence becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups.
I heard that this causes $W_K$ to have a finer topology than the usual subspace topology, $I_K$ to be open and the maximal compact subgroup of $W_K$ etc. but I do not really understand that.
Could you please explain this to me? Thank you!
abstract-algebra general-topology group-theory algebraic-number-theory topological-groups
$endgroup$
Let $1 to H_1 to G to H_2 to 1$ be a short exact sequence of abstract groups.
Question: If $H_1$, $H_2$ have fixed topologies, can we endow $G$ with a topology such that the sequence above becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups? If yes, is this topology then uniquely determined?
Motivation: I want to understand the topology of the Weil group $W_K$ which is a dense subgroup of the absolute Galois group $G_K$ (which has this weird profinite topology I find hard to get). However, we have a short exact sequence of abstract groups
$$1 to I_K to W_K to langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle to 1$$
where $I_K$ denotes the inertia subgroup of $G_K$ and $operatorname{Frob}_k : x mapsto x^{|k|}$ is the Frobenius element of the absolute Galois group $G_k$ of the residue field $k$ of $K$.
If I understand it correctly, this sequence is not a short exact sequence of topological groups if we give $W_K$ the subspace topology of $G_K$. However, if we give $I_K$ and $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ the subspace topologies of $G_K$ and $G_k$ respectively, we can give $W_K$ a unique topology such that this sequence becomes a short exact sequence of topological groups.
I heard that this causes $W_K$ to have a finer topology than the usual subspace topology, $I_K$ to be open and the maximal compact subgroup of $W_K$ etc. but I do not really understand that.
Could you please explain this to me? Thank you!
abstract-algebra general-topology group-theory algebraic-number-theory topological-groups
abstract-algebra general-topology group-theory algebraic-number-theory topological-groups
edited Jan 6 at 13:12
Diglett
asked Jan 6 at 12:41
DiglettDiglett
9261521
9261521
3
$begingroup$
You don't want $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ to have the suspace topology from $G_k$, but instead the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– MatheinBoulomenos
Jan 6 at 21:32
add a comment |
3
$begingroup$
You don't want $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ to have the suspace topology from $G_k$, but instead the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– MatheinBoulomenos
Jan 6 at 21:32
3
3
$begingroup$
You don't want $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ to have the suspace topology from $G_k$, but instead the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– MatheinBoulomenos
Jan 6 at 21:32
$begingroup$
You don't want $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ to have the suspace topology from $G_k$, but instead the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– MatheinBoulomenos
Jan 6 at 21:32
add a comment |
1 Answer
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oldest
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$begingroup$
Not saying anything about the Weil group at this point. Trying to settle the first question instead with the following construction that smacks of cheating.
Let $i:H_1to G$ be the monomorphism, and $p:Gto H_2$ be the epimorphism in this short exact sequence. Exactness means that $N:=i(H_1)=ker(p)unlhd G$. If I got it right $H_1$ and $H_2$ are topological groups, and you want to give a topology to $G$ so that $G$ becomes a topological group, and the mappings $i,p$ are continuous.
Unless I made a silly mistake this can be achieved by giving $G$ the topology defined by letting the cosets of $N$ to form a basis. In other words, the open sets of $G$ are the arbitrary unions of cosets of $N$. This is trivially a topology $tau$. Furthermore:
$p:(G,tau)to H_2$ is continuous for much the same reason that any mapping from a discrete space to any topological space is continuous. The preimage of any subset of $H_2$ is a union of cosets of $N$.
$i:H_1to(G,tau)$ is continuous for much the same reason that any map to a space with a trivial topology is continuous. The preimage of any open subset $intau$ is either all of $H_1$ or the empty set.
$(G,tau)$ is a topological group. For if $x,yin G$ are arbitrary, then the product map $m:Gtimes Gto G, m(x,y)=xy$ satisfies $m(xN,yN)subseteq xyN$. Any open set containing $xy$ contains the coset $xyN$, so continuity of $m$ follows. Continuity of the inverse mapping is verified in the same way.
Seems to me that you really wanted to ask a slightly different question. I'm afraid I cannot suggest one. Anwyway, it seems morally certain to me that the topology $G$ needs to have to satisfy items 1 to 3 is not unique at all.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
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$begingroup$
Not saying anything about the Weil group at this point. Trying to settle the first question instead with the following construction that smacks of cheating.
Let $i:H_1to G$ be the monomorphism, and $p:Gto H_2$ be the epimorphism in this short exact sequence. Exactness means that $N:=i(H_1)=ker(p)unlhd G$. If I got it right $H_1$ and $H_2$ are topological groups, and you want to give a topology to $G$ so that $G$ becomes a topological group, and the mappings $i,p$ are continuous.
Unless I made a silly mistake this can be achieved by giving $G$ the topology defined by letting the cosets of $N$ to form a basis. In other words, the open sets of $G$ are the arbitrary unions of cosets of $N$. This is trivially a topology $tau$. Furthermore:
$p:(G,tau)to H_2$ is continuous for much the same reason that any mapping from a discrete space to any topological space is continuous. The preimage of any subset of $H_2$ is a union of cosets of $N$.
$i:H_1to(G,tau)$ is continuous for much the same reason that any map to a space with a trivial topology is continuous. The preimage of any open subset $intau$ is either all of $H_1$ or the empty set.
$(G,tau)$ is a topological group. For if $x,yin G$ are arbitrary, then the product map $m:Gtimes Gto G, m(x,y)=xy$ satisfies $m(xN,yN)subseteq xyN$. Any open set containing $xy$ contains the coset $xyN$, so continuity of $m$ follows. Continuity of the inverse mapping is verified in the same way.
Seems to me that you really wanted to ask a slightly different question. I'm afraid I cannot suggest one. Anwyway, it seems morally certain to me that the topology $G$ needs to have to satisfy items 1 to 3 is not unique at all.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Not saying anything about the Weil group at this point. Trying to settle the first question instead with the following construction that smacks of cheating.
Let $i:H_1to G$ be the monomorphism, and $p:Gto H_2$ be the epimorphism in this short exact sequence. Exactness means that $N:=i(H_1)=ker(p)unlhd G$. If I got it right $H_1$ and $H_2$ are topological groups, and you want to give a topology to $G$ so that $G$ becomes a topological group, and the mappings $i,p$ are continuous.
Unless I made a silly mistake this can be achieved by giving $G$ the topology defined by letting the cosets of $N$ to form a basis. In other words, the open sets of $G$ are the arbitrary unions of cosets of $N$. This is trivially a topology $tau$. Furthermore:
$p:(G,tau)to H_2$ is continuous for much the same reason that any mapping from a discrete space to any topological space is continuous. The preimage of any subset of $H_2$ is a union of cosets of $N$.
$i:H_1to(G,tau)$ is continuous for much the same reason that any map to a space with a trivial topology is continuous. The preimage of any open subset $intau$ is either all of $H_1$ or the empty set.
$(G,tau)$ is a topological group. For if $x,yin G$ are arbitrary, then the product map $m:Gtimes Gto G, m(x,y)=xy$ satisfies $m(xN,yN)subseteq xyN$. Any open set containing $xy$ contains the coset $xyN$, so continuity of $m$ follows. Continuity of the inverse mapping is verified in the same way.
Seems to me that you really wanted to ask a slightly different question. I'm afraid I cannot suggest one. Anwyway, it seems morally certain to me that the topology $G$ needs to have to satisfy items 1 to 3 is not unique at all.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Not saying anything about the Weil group at this point. Trying to settle the first question instead with the following construction that smacks of cheating.
Let $i:H_1to G$ be the monomorphism, and $p:Gto H_2$ be the epimorphism in this short exact sequence. Exactness means that $N:=i(H_1)=ker(p)unlhd G$. If I got it right $H_1$ and $H_2$ are topological groups, and you want to give a topology to $G$ so that $G$ becomes a topological group, and the mappings $i,p$ are continuous.
Unless I made a silly mistake this can be achieved by giving $G$ the topology defined by letting the cosets of $N$ to form a basis. In other words, the open sets of $G$ are the arbitrary unions of cosets of $N$. This is trivially a topology $tau$. Furthermore:
$p:(G,tau)to H_2$ is continuous for much the same reason that any mapping from a discrete space to any topological space is continuous. The preimage of any subset of $H_2$ is a union of cosets of $N$.
$i:H_1to(G,tau)$ is continuous for much the same reason that any map to a space with a trivial topology is continuous. The preimage of any open subset $intau$ is either all of $H_1$ or the empty set.
$(G,tau)$ is a topological group. For if $x,yin G$ are arbitrary, then the product map $m:Gtimes Gto G, m(x,y)=xy$ satisfies $m(xN,yN)subseteq xyN$. Any open set containing $xy$ contains the coset $xyN$, so continuity of $m$ follows. Continuity of the inverse mapping is verified in the same way.
Seems to me that you really wanted to ask a slightly different question. I'm afraid I cannot suggest one. Anwyway, it seems morally certain to me that the topology $G$ needs to have to satisfy items 1 to 3 is not unique at all.
$endgroup$
Not saying anything about the Weil group at this point. Trying to settle the first question instead with the following construction that smacks of cheating.
Let $i:H_1to G$ be the monomorphism, and $p:Gto H_2$ be the epimorphism in this short exact sequence. Exactness means that $N:=i(H_1)=ker(p)unlhd G$. If I got it right $H_1$ and $H_2$ are topological groups, and you want to give a topology to $G$ so that $G$ becomes a topological group, and the mappings $i,p$ are continuous.
Unless I made a silly mistake this can be achieved by giving $G$ the topology defined by letting the cosets of $N$ to form a basis. In other words, the open sets of $G$ are the arbitrary unions of cosets of $N$. This is trivially a topology $tau$. Furthermore:
$p:(G,tau)to H_2$ is continuous for much the same reason that any mapping from a discrete space to any topological space is continuous. The preimage of any subset of $H_2$ is a union of cosets of $N$.
$i:H_1to(G,tau)$ is continuous for much the same reason that any map to a space with a trivial topology is continuous. The preimage of any open subset $intau$ is either all of $H_1$ or the empty set.
$(G,tau)$ is a topological group. For if $x,yin G$ are arbitrary, then the product map $m:Gtimes Gto G, m(x,y)=xy$ satisfies $m(xN,yN)subseteq xyN$. Any open set containing $xy$ contains the coset $xyN$, so continuity of $m$ follows. Continuity of the inverse mapping is verified in the same way.
Seems to me that you really wanted to ask a slightly different question. I'm afraid I cannot suggest one. Anwyway, it seems morally certain to me that the topology $G$ needs to have to satisfy items 1 to 3 is not unique at all.
answered Jan 6 at 19:07
Jyrki LahtonenJyrki Lahtonen
108k12166368
108k12166368
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$begingroup$
You don't want $langle operatorname{Frob}_k rangle$ to have the suspace topology from $G_k$, but instead the discrete topology.
$endgroup$
– MatheinBoulomenos
Jan 6 at 21:32