Why are Leela's fans so passionate? [on hold]












9















The neural-network engine Leela is a relatively new one. It's also got some extremely passionate fans. For example they write things like this:




Wait 5-6 months, and we will see SF8 on uber-duper logarithmic in cores Elo-wise 32 cores being smashed by Lc0 on my puny single 1060.




Watching Leela's fans argue up and down Talkchess, Chess.com's computer championship chat and TCEC chat, about how their engine is / isn't superior to Stockfish because of [multitude of factors] or how their engine is going to crush Stockfish after the next learning rate drop, about how the "end of an era" is at hand, etc, makes me wonder: why are Leela's fans so passionate?



I don't recall seeing anything similar to this before Leela showed up. It's not like Leela is so special either: before Leela showed up, Stockfish, Komodo and Houdini dominated engine chess, and there were periods when any of the three were the strongest engine. But I don't recall seeing any of their fans displaying the same level of intensity.










share|improve this question















put on hold as primarily opinion-based by Akavall, fuxia, Yaron, Annatar, Phonon 2 days ago


Many good questions generate some degree of opinion based on expert experience, but answers to this question will tend to be almost entirely based on opinions, rather than facts, references, or specific expertise. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.











  • 2





    The difference is that normal engines have sort of a cap to what they can improve, whereas engines based on neural networks do not

    – Isac
    2 days ago






  • 2





    Neurals are capped by things like how many "hidden layers" they have and how many perceptrons they use in those hidden layers. They are most definitely "capped".

    – Owl
    2 days ago
















9















The neural-network engine Leela is a relatively new one. It's also got some extremely passionate fans. For example they write things like this:




Wait 5-6 months, and we will see SF8 on uber-duper logarithmic in cores Elo-wise 32 cores being smashed by Lc0 on my puny single 1060.




Watching Leela's fans argue up and down Talkchess, Chess.com's computer championship chat and TCEC chat, about how their engine is / isn't superior to Stockfish because of [multitude of factors] or how their engine is going to crush Stockfish after the next learning rate drop, about how the "end of an era" is at hand, etc, makes me wonder: why are Leela's fans so passionate?



I don't recall seeing anything similar to this before Leela showed up. It's not like Leela is so special either: before Leela showed up, Stockfish, Komodo and Houdini dominated engine chess, and there were periods when any of the three were the strongest engine. But I don't recall seeing any of their fans displaying the same level of intensity.










share|improve this question















put on hold as primarily opinion-based by Akavall, fuxia, Yaron, Annatar, Phonon 2 days ago


Many good questions generate some degree of opinion based on expert experience, but answers to this question will tend to be almost entirely based on opinions, rather than facts, references, or specific expertise. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.











  • 2





    The difference is that normal engines have sort of a cap to what they can improve, whereas engines based on neural networks do not

    – Isac
    2 days ago






  • 2





    Neurals are capped by things like how many "hidden layers" they have and how many perceptrons they use in those hidden layers. They are most definitely "capped".

    – Owl
    2 days ago














9












9








9


1






The neural-network engine Leela is a relatively new one. It's also got some extremely passionate fans. For example they write things like this:




Wait 5-6 months, and we will see SF8 on uber-duper logarithmic in cores Elo-wise 32 cores being smashed by Lc0 on my puny single 1060.




Watching Leela's fans argue up and down Talkchess, Chess.com's computer championship chat and TCEC chat, about how their engine is / isn't superior to Stockfish because of [multitude of factors] or how their engine is going to crush Stockfish after the next learning rate drop, about how the "end of an era" is at hand, etc, makes me wonder: why are Leela's fans so passionate?



I don't recall seeing anything similar to this before Leela showed up. It's not like Leela is so special either: before Leela showed up, Stockfish, Komodo and Houdini dominated engine chess, and there were periods when any of the three were the strongest engine. But I don't recall seeing any of their fans displaying the same level of intensity.










share|improve this question
















The neural-network engine Leela is a relatively new one. It's also got some extremely passionate fans. For example they write things like this:




Wait 5-6 months, and we will see SF8 on uber-duper logarithmic in cores Elo-wise 32 cores being smashed by Lc0 on my puny single 1060.




Watching Leela's fans argue up and down Talkchess, Chess.com's computer championship chat and TCEC chat, about how their engine is / isn't superior to Stockfish because of [multitude of factors] or how their engine is going to crush Stockfish after the next learning rate drop, about how the "end of an era" is at hand, etc, makes me wonder: why are Leela's fans so passionate?



I don't recall seeing anything similar to this before Leela showed up. It's not like Leela is so special either: before Leela showed up, Stockfish, Komodo and Houdini dominated engine chess, and there were periods when any of the three were the strongest engine. But I don't recall seeing any of their fans displaying the same level of intensity.







engines stockfish leela






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share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 2 days ago









SmallChess

14.8k22248




14.8k22248










asked Jan 14 at 0:22









AllureAllure

1,168318




1,168318




put on hold as primarily opinion-based by Akavall, fuxia, Yaron, Annatar, Phonon 2 days ago


Many good questions generate some degree of opinion based on expert experience, but answers to this question will tend to be almost entirely based on opinions, rather than facts, references, or specific expertise. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.






put on hold as primarily opinion-based by Akavall, fuxia, Yaron, Annatar, Phonon 2 days ago


Many good questions generate some degree of opinion based on expert experience, but answers to this question will tend to be almost entirely based on opinions, rather than facts, references, or specific expertise. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.










  • 2





    The difference is that normal engines have sort of a cap to what they can improve, whereas engines based on neural networks do not

    – Isac
    2 days ago






  • 2





    Neurals are capped by things like how many "hidden layers" they have and how many perceptrons they use in those hidden layers. They are most definitely "capped".

    – Owl
    2 days ago














  • 2





    The difference is that normal engines have sort of a cap to what they can improve, whereas engines based on neural networks do not

    – Isac
    2 days ago






  • 2





    Neurals are capped by things like how many "hidden layers" they have and how many perceptrons they use in those hidden layers. They are most definitely "capped".

    – Owl
    2 days ago








2




2





The difference is that normal engines have sort of a cap to what they can improve, whereas engines based on neural networks do not

– Isac
2 days ago





The difference is that normal engines have sort of a cap to what they can improve, whereas engines based on neural networks do not

– Isac
2 days ago




2




2





Neurals are capped by things like how many "hidden layers" they have and how many perceptrons they use in those hidden layers. They are most definitely "capped".

– Owl
2 days ago





Neurals are capped by things like how many "hidden layers" they have and how many perceptrons they use in those hidden layers. They are most definitely "capped".

– Owl
2 days ago










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















16














You can't really objectively answer this question, but I'll share my view.



One of the important factors to take into account is that Leela Chess Zero project requires tremendous computational resources to complete. The way project attains those resources is by convincing large number of people to donate part of their machine time to that project.



To make this work, project needs to sustain strong community that clearly sees its goals, ideas and progress. There have been done many things for that: there is a very active discord chat, google groups, blog, you can see lots of graphs and metrics regarding project status, there are very detailed spreadsheets, etc. Also some chess youtubers helped this project grow community (e.g. KingsCrusher and ChessNetwork) by featuring it in their videos.



Beating StockFish is one of the very important goals of this community.



When people are united around some idea, it's because they are passionate about it. The behavior you are describing looks the same as when people argue about politics, football, religion, nationality, etc.






share|improve this answer








New contributor




D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.




























    9














    Leela is special because it's the first strong open-source deep-learning engine. Defeating Stockfish (and also Komodo and Houdini) convincingly on all settings is a very significant milestone, practically more important than Google's AlphaZero. Google's system is inaccessible to anyone but themself.



    Human-understandable evaluation function has always been part of engine design, since it started around 30 years ago. Leela, running on a complex neural network evaluation will be the first open-source "intelligent" leading chess engine. The engine "learns" chess by NN machine learning, a much smarter programming technique than random heuristics programming. Engine programmers no longer have to guess/hardcode engine heuristics!



    For the first time in history, we will have access to a free and strong "intelligent" chess engine. Stockfish is also strong but it knows nothing about chess.



    The era of none-AI evaluation will soon end. Stockfish, Houdini and Komodo will soon fade in existence. Chess engines adopting classical programming techniques will no longer lead the world. Leela is the future, Stockfish will be history.






    share|improve this answer





















    • 11





      Wow, now you are sounding like a Leela fan ...

      – Allure
      Jan 14 at 0:47






    • 2





      -1 because this is not an answer to this question. This is a paragraph of Leela fanboyism. A proper answer should list the reasons that make one understand why there are hype around lc0.

      – Voile
      2 days ago






    • 4





      @Voile "why" is in the first paragraph.

      – SmallChess
      2 days ago






    • 4





      @Voile the question asked ("why are leela fans so passionate") requires an in-depth summarization of the viewpoints of said fans, and as such, I believe this answer is perfectly acceptable. And, Voile, I might add that some of your comments are out of line with respect to polite discourse on this site (particularly the ad-hominem attacks on SmallChess).

      – user45266
      2 days ago






    • 3





      Any claim that a poster's content is fanboyistic (maybe that's a word?) is also an attack on the poster, as clearly that was not meant in a good way. As others have mentioned, the question asks for what is a biased opinion in order to better understand the arguments of others. It'd be like if I called someone's question "insolent". Clearly, I'm also alluding to the person being insolent as well, making it at the very least inappropriate for respectful commentary.

      – user45266
      2 days ago



















    5














    Anytime a group of people get extremely hyped about something (and especially when they aggressively bash alternatives), there's a good chance this is just human tribalism at work. Leela may become extremely strong in the near future, but to say with 100% certainty this will happen now is naive.



    People also like change. Stockfish is a revolutionary engine (strong evaluation function based on a huge number of heuristics, and an incredibly fast searching function), but it's been the top dog for a long time. No matter how good things are, eventually people want something even better. It's what drives society forward.



    Again, I'm not saying it's impossible for Leela to live up to its hype. It's just that this hype you're describing isn't currently warranted.






    share|improve this answer



















    • 2





      "People also like change" not if they have to change something about themselves they don't

      – NoseKnowsAll
      2 days ago


















    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes








    3 Answers
    3






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    16














    You can't really objectively answer this question, but I'll share my view.



    One of the important factors to take into account is that Leela Chess Zero project requires tremendous computational resources to complete. The way project attains those resources is by convincing large number of people to donate part of their machine time to that project.



    To make this work, project needs to sustain strong community that clearly sees its goals, ideas and progress. There have been done many things for that: there is a very active discord chat, google groups, blog, you can see lots of graphs and metrics regarding project status, there are very detailed spreadsheets, etc. Also some chess youtubers helped this project grow community (e.g. KingsCrusher and ChessNetwork) by featuring it in their videos.



    Beating StockFish is one of the very important goals of this community.



    When people are united around some idea, it's because they are passionate about it. The behavior you are describing looks the same as when people argue about politics, football, religion, nationality, etc.






    share|improve this answer








    New contributor




    D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
    Check out our Code of Conduct.

























      16














      You can't really objectively answer this question, but I'll share my view.



      One of the important factors to take into account is that Leela Chess Zero project requires tremendous computational resources to complete. The way project attains those resources is by convincing large number of people to donate part of their machine time to that project.



      To make this work, project needs to sustain strong community that clearly sees its goals, ideas and progress. There have been done many things for that: there is a very active discord chat, google groups, blog, you can see lots of graphs and metrics regarding project status, there are very detailed spreadsheets, etc. Also some chess youtubers helped this project grow community (e.g. KingsCrusher and ChessNetwork) by featuring it in their videos.



      Beating StockFish is one of the very important goals of this community.



      When people are united around some idea, it's because they are passionate about it. The behavior you are describing looks the same as when people argue about politics, football, religion, nationality, etc.






      share|improve this answer








      New contributor




      D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.























        16












        16








        16







        You can't really objectively answer this question, but I'll share my view.



        One of the important factors to take into account is that Leela Chess Zero project requires tremendous computational resources to complete. The way project attains those resources is by convincing large number of people to donate part of their machine time to that project.



        To make this work, project needs to sustain strong community that clearly sees its goals, ideas and progress. There have been done many things for that: there is a very active discord chat, google groups, blog, you can see lots of graphs and metrics regarding project status, there are very detailed spreadsheets, etc. Also some chess youtubers helped this project grow community (e.g. KingsCrusher and ChessNetwork) by featuring it in their videos.



        Beating StockFish is one of the very important goals of this community.



        When people are united around some idea, it's because they are passionate about it. The behavior you are describing looks the same as when people argue about politics, football, religion, nationality, etc.






        share|improve this answer








        New contributor




        D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.










        You can't really objectively answer this question, but I'll share my view.



        One of the important factors to take into account is that Leela Chess Zero project requires tremendous computational resources to complete. The way project attains those resources is by convincing large number of people to donate part of their machine time to that project.



        To make this work, project needs to sustain strong community that clearly sees its goals, ideas and progress. There have been done many things for that: there is a very active discord chat, google groups, blog, you can see lots of graphs and metrics regarding project status, there are very detailed spreadsheets, etc. Also some chess youtubers helped this project grow community (e.g. KingsCrusher and ChessNetwork) by featuring it in their videos.



        Beating StockFish is one of the very important goals of this community.



        When people are united around some idea, it's because they are passionate about it. The behavior you are describing looks the same as when people argue about politics, football, religion, nationality, etc.







        share|improve this answer








        New contributor




        D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.









        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer






        New contributor




        D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.









        answered 2 days ago









        D. DmitriyD. Dmitriy

        1842




        1842




        New contributor




        D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.





        New contributor





        D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.






        D. Dmitriy is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
        Check out our Code of Conduct.























            9














            Leela is special because it's the first strong open-source deep-learning engine. Defeating Stockfish (and also Komodo and Houdini) convincingly on all settings is a very significant milestone, practically more important than Google's AlphaZero. Google's system is inaccessible to anyone but themself.



            Human-understandable evaluation function has always been part of engine design, since it started around 30 years ago. Leela, running on a complex neural network evaluation will be the first open-source "intelligent" leading chess engine. The engine "learns" chess by NN machine learning, a much smarter programming technique than random heuristics programming. Engine programmers no longer have to guess/hardcode engine heuristics!



            For the first time in history, we will have access to a free and strong "intelligent" chess engine. Stockfish is also strong but it knows nothing about chess.



            The era of none-AI evaluation will soon end. Stockfish, Houdini and Komodo will soon fade in existence. Chess engines adopting classical programming techniques will no longer lead the world. Leela is the future, Stockfish will be history.






            share|improve this answer





















            • 11





              Wow, now you are sounding like a Leela fan ...

              – Allure
              Jan 14 at 0:47






            • 2





              -1 because this is not an answer to this question. This is a paragraph of Leela fanboyism. A proper answer should list the reasons that make one understand why there are hype around lc0.

              – Voile
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile "why" is in the first paragraph.

              – SmallChess
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile the question asked ("why are leela fans so passionate") requires an in-depth summarization of the viewpoints of said fans, and as such, I believe this answer is perfectly acceptable. And, Voile, I might add that some of your comments are out of line with respect to polite discourse on this site (particularly the ad-hominem attacks on SmallChess).

              – user45266
              2 days ago






            • 3





              Any claim that a poster's content is fanboyistic (maybe that's a word?) is also an attack on the poster, as clearly that was not meant in a good way. As others have mentioned, the question asks for what is a biased opinion in order to better understand the arguments of others. It'd be like if I called someone's question "insolent". Clearly, I'm also alluding to the person being insolent as well, making it at the very least inappropriate for respectful commentary.

              – user45266
              2 days ago
















            9














            Leela is special because it's the first strong open-source deep-learning engine. Defeating Stockfish (and also Komodo and Houdini) convincingly on all settings is a very significant milestone, practically more important than Google's AlphaZero. Google's system is inaccessible to anyone but themself.



            Human-understandable evaluation function has always been part of engine design, since it started around 30 years ago. Leela, running on a complex neural network evaluation will be the first open-source "intelligent" leading chess engine. The engine "learns" chess by NN machine learning, a much smarter programming technique than random heuristics programming. Engine programmers no longer have to guess/hardcode engine heuristics!



            For the first time in history, we will have access to a free and strong "intelligent" chess engine. Stockfish is also strong but it knows nothing about chess.



            The era of none-AI evaluation will soon end. Stockfish, Houdini and Komodo will soon fade in existence. Chess engines adopting classical programming techniques will no longer lead the world. Leela is the future, Stockfish will be history.






            share|improve this answer





















            • 11





              Wow, now you are sounding like a Leela fan ...

              – Allure
              Jan 14 at 0:47






            • 2





              -1 because this is not an answer to this question. This is a paragraph of Leela fanboyism. A proper answer should list the reasons that make one understand why there are hype around lc0.

              – Voile
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile "why" is in the first paragraph.

              – SmallChess
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile the question asked ("why are leela fans so passionate") requires an in-depth summarization of the viewpoints of said fans, and as such, I believe this answer is perfectly acceptable. And, Voile, I might add that some of your comments are out of line with respect to polite discourse on this site (particularly the ad-hominem attacks on SmallChess).

              – user45266
              2 days ago






            • 3





              Any claim that a poster's content is fanboyistic (maybe that's a word?) is also an attack on the poster, as clearly that was not meant in a good way. As others have mentioned, the question asks for what is a biased opinion in order to better understand the arguments of others. It'd be like if I called someone's question "insolent". Clearly, I'm also alluding to the person being insolent as well, making it at the very least inappropriate for respectful commentary.

              – user45266
              2 days ago














            9












            9








            9







            Leela is special because it's the first strong open-source deep-learning engine. Defeating Stockfish (and also Komodo and Houdini) convincingly on all settings is a very significant milestone, practically more important than Google's AlphaZero. Google's system is inaccessible to anyone but themself.



            Human-understandable evaluation function has always been part of engine design, since it started around 30 years ago. Leela, running on a complex neural network evaluation will be the first open-source "intelligent" leading chess engine. The engine "learns" chess by NN machine learning, a much smarter programming technique than random heuristics programming. Engine programmers no longer have to guess/hardcode engine heuristics!



            For the first time in history, we will have access to a free and strong "intelligent" chess engine. Stockfish is also strong but it knows nothing about chess.



            The era of none-AI evaluation will soon end. Stockfish, Houdini and Komodo will soon fade in existence. Chess engines adopting classical programming techniques will no longer lead the world. Leela is the future, Stockfish will be history.






            share|improve this answer















            Leela is special because it's the first strong open-source deep-learning engine. Defeating Stockfish (and also Komodo and Houdini) convincingly on all settings is a very significant milestone, practically more important than Google's AlphaZero. Google's system is inaccessible to anyone but themself.



            Human-understandable evaluation function has always been part of engine design, since it started around 30 years ago. Leela, running on a complex neural network evaluation will be the first open-source "intelligent" leading chess engine. The engine "learns" chess by NN machine learning, a much smarter programming technique than random heuristics programming. Engine programmers no longer have to guess/hardcode engine heuristics!



            For the first time in history, we will have access to a free and strong "intelligent" chess engine. Stockfish is also strong but it knows nothing about chess.



            The era of none-AI evaluation will soon end. Stockfish, Houdini and Komodo will soon fade in existence. Chess engines adopting classical programming techniques will no longer lead the world. Leela is the future, Stockfish will be history.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited 2 days ago

























            answered Jan 14 at 0:33









            SmallChessSmallChess

            14.8k22248




            14.8k22248








            • 11





              Wow, now you are sounding like a Leela fan ...

              – Allure
              Jan 14 at 0:47






            • 2





              -1 because this is not an answer to this question. This is a paragraph of Leela fanboyism. A proper answer should list the reasons that make one understand why there are hype around lc0.

              – Voile
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile "why" is in the first paragraph.

              – SmallChess
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile the question asked ("why are leela fans so passionate") requires an in-depth summarization of the viewpoints of said fans, and as such, I believe this answer is perfectly acceptable. And, Voile, I might add that some of your comments are out of line with respect to polite discourse on this site (particularly the ad-hominem attacks on SmallChess).

              – user45266
              2 days ago






            • 3





              Any claim that a poster's content is fanboyistic (maybe that's a word?) is also an attack on the poster, as clearly that was not meant in a good way. As others have mentioned, the question asks for what is a biased opinion in order to better understand the arguments of others. It'd be like if I called someone's question "insolent". Clearly, I'm also alluding to the person being insolent as well, making it at the very least inappropriate for respectful commentary.

              – user45266
              2 days ago














            • 11





              Wow, now you are sounding like a Leela fan ...

              – Allure
              Jan 14 at 0:47






            • 2





              -1 because this is not an answer to this question. This is a paragraph of Leela fanboyism. A proper answer should list the reasons that make one understand why there are hype around lc0.

              – Voile
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile "why" is in the first paragraph.

              – SmallChess
              2 days ago






            • 4





              @Voile the question asked ("why are leela fans so passionate") requires an in-depth summarization of the viewpoints of said fans, and as such, I believe this answer is perfectly acceptable. And, Voile, I might add that some of your comments are out of line with respect to polite discourse on this site (particularly the ad-hominem attacks on SmallChess).

              – user45266
              2 days ago






            • 3





              Any claim that a poster's content is fanboyistic (maybe that's a word?) is also an attack on the poster, as clearly that was not meant in a good way. As others have mentioned, the question asks for what is a biased opinion in order to better understand the arguments of others. It'd be like if I called someone's question "insolent". Clearly, I'm also alluding to the person being insolent as well, making it at the very least inappropriate for respectful commentary.

              – user45266
              2 days ago








            11




            11





            Wow, now you are sounding like a Leela fan ...

            – Allure
            Jan 14 at 0:47





            Wow, now you are sounding like a Leela fan ...

            – Allure
            Jan 14 at 0:47




            2




            2





            -1 because this is not an answer to this question. This is a paragraph of Leela fanboyism. A proper answer should list the reasons that make one understand why there are hype around lc0.

            – Voile
            2 days ago





            -1 because this is not an answer to this question. This is a paragraph of Leela fanboyism. A proper answer should list the reasons that make one understand why there are hype around lc0.

            – Voile
            2 days ago




            4




            4





            @Voile "why" is in the first paragraph.

            – SmallChess
            2 days ago





            @Voile "why" is in the first paragraph.

            – SmallChess
            2 days ago




            4




            4





            @Voile the question asked ("why are leela fans so passionate") requires an in-depth summarization of the viewpoints of said fans, and as such, I believe this answer is perfectly acceptable. And, Voile, I might add that some of your comments are out of line with respect to polite discourse on this site (particularly the ad-hominem attacks on SmallChess).

            – user45266
            2 days ago





            @Voile the question asked ("why are leela fans so passionate") requires an in-depth summarization of the viewpoints of said fans, and as such, I believe this answer is perfectly acceptable. And, Voile, I might add that some of your comments are out of line with respect to polite discourse on this site (particularly the ad-hominem attacks on SmallChess).

            – user45266
            2 days ago




            3




            3





            Any claim that a poster's content is fanboyistic (maybe that's a word?) is also an attack on the poster, as clearly that was not meant in a good way. As others have mentioned, the question asks for what is a biased opinion in order to better understand the arguments of others. It'd be like if I called someone's question "insolent". Clearly, I'm also alluding to the person being insolent as well, making it at the very least inappropriate for respectful commentary.

            – user45266
            2 days ago





            Any claim that a poster's content is fanboyistic (maybe that's a word?) is also an attack on the poster, as clearly that was not meant in a good way. As others have mentioned, the question asks for what is a biased opinion in order to better understand the arguments of others. It'd be like if I called someone's question "insolent". Clearly, I'm also alluding to the person being insolent as well, making it at the very least inappropriate for respectful commentary.

            – user45266
            2 days ago











            5














            Anytime a group of people get extremely hyped about something (and especially when they aggressively bash alternatives), there's a good chance this is just human tribalism at work. Leela may become extremely strong in the near future, but to say with 100% certainty this will happen now is naive.



            People also like change. Stockfish is a revolutionary engine (strong evaluation function based on a huge number of heuristics, and an incredibly fast searching function), but it's been the top dog for a long time. No matter how good things are, eventually people want something even better. It's what drives society forward.



            Again, I'm not saying it's impossible for Leela to live up to its hype. It's just that this hype you're describing isn't currently warranted.






            share|improve this answer



















            • 2





              "People also like change" not if they have to change something about themselves they don't

              – NoseKnowsAll
              2 days ago
















            5














            Anytime a group of people get extremely hyped about something (and especially when they aggressively bash alternatives), there's a good chance this is just human tribalism at work. Leela may become extremely strong in the near future, but to say with 100% certainty this will happen now is naive.



            People also like change. Stockfish is a revolutionary engine (strong evaluation function based on a huge number of heuristics, and an incredibly fast searching function), but it's been the top dog for a long time. No matter how good things are, eventually people want something even better. It's what drives society forward.



            Again, I'm not saying it's impossible for Leela to live up to its hype. It's just that this hype you're describing isn't currently warranted.






            share|improve this answer



















            • 2





              "People also like change" not if they have to change something about themselves they don't

              – NoseKnowsAll
              2 days ago














            5












            5








            5







            Anytime a group of people get extremely hyped about something (and especially when they aggressively bash alternatives), there's a good chance this is just human tribalism at work. Leela may become extremely strong in the near future, but to say with 100% certainty this will happen now is naive.



            People also like change. Stockfish is a revolutionary engine (strong evaluation function based on a huge number of heuristics, and an incredibly fast searching function), but it's been the top dog for a long time. No matter how good things are, eventually people want something even better. It's what drives society forward.



            Again, I'm not saying it's impossible for Leela to live up to its hype. It's just that this hype you're describing isn't currently warranted.






            share|improve this answer













            Anytime a group of people get extremely hyped about something (and especially when they aggressively bash alternatives), there's a good chance this is just human tribalism at work. Leela may become extremely strong in the near future, but to say with 100% certainty this will happen now is naive.



            People also like change. Stockfish is a revolutionary engine (strong evaluation function based on a huge number of heuristics, and an incredibly fast searching function), but it's been the top dog for a long time. No matter how good things are, eventually people want something even better. It's what drives society forward.



            Again, I'm not saying it's impossible for Leela to live up to its hype. It's just that this hype you're describing isn't currently warranted.







            share|improve this answer












            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer










            answered 2 days ago









            Inertial IgnoranceInertial Ignorance

            3,526110




            3,526110








            • 2





              "People also like change" not if they have to change something about themselves they don't

              – NoseKnowsAll
              2 days ago














            • 2





              "People also like change" not if they have to change something about themselves they don't

              – NoseKnowsAll
              2 days ago








            2




            2





            "People also like change" not if they have to change something about themselves they don't

            – NoseKnowsAll
            2 days ago





            "People also like change" not if they have to change something about themselves they don't

            – NoseKnowsAll
            2 days ago



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